The Journey to Staff Engineer In Big Tech (Panel Discussion) - Sep 2023

The journey to Staff Engineer is unique for everybody. In this session, we talk about all the ways we got there! Senior Engineer is a terminal level at most tech companies.

Staff Engineer is the next level up. This is referred to as Staff at Meta/Google, or Principal Engineer at Amazon/Microsoft.

Themes discussed in the video:

- Staff Engineers need to have multiplicative impact and influence across multiple teams. There are several ways to achieve this (occasionally referred to as archetypes): code machine, architect, product thinking, fixer, and more.
- Communication, and right-sizing it to the level and discipline of your audience, is critically important.
- Being able to speak to real, quantifiable numbers when it comes to the impact you have is essential.
- Staff engineers are typically known as the experts in certain domains or situations. Becoming well-known in an area is a skill and does require some amount of marketing.

See discussions about Staff Engineers on Taro: <https://www.jointaro.com/topic/staff-engineer/>

Publicly available promotion stories:

- [Ryan's Instagram video processing improvements](https://engineering.fb.com/2022/11/04/video-engineering/instagram-video-processing-encoding-reduction/)
- [Rahul's internal tool for debugging](https://www.jointaro.com/lesson/qvp2quodqAEWSkN7sayt/case-study-building-a-meta-internal-tool-to-empower-an-entire-org-staff-promotion-story/)

Panelists:

- [Zach Wilson](https://www.linkedin.com/in/eczachly/)
- [Rahul Pandey](https://www.linkedin.com/in/rpandey1234/)
- [Carly Taylor](https://www.linkedin.com/in/carly-taylor-data/)
- [Lee McKeeman](https://www.linkedin.com/in/lmckeeman/)
- [Ryan Peterman](https://www.linkedin.com/in/ryanlpeterman/)

Watch the [Q&A portion of the panel here.](https://www.jointaro.com/lesson/P7bEwvDaCuYRfEtmfcaL/the-journey-to-staff-engineer-in-big-tech-qanda/)

Watch the full [Senior to Staff course on Taro](https://www.jointaro.com/lesson/NE3J4vWP7BoWlNgbRtCw/becoming-a-staff-engineer-in-big-tech-panel-discussion/).

How Do Effective Engineering Leaders Help Their Teams Achieve More?

3 questions engineering leaders ask to increase the impact of their team without burning the midnight oil: 

1. What parts of this project are most critical? Who is most important for success? 
2. Can I optimize/shortcut some part of this project? 
3. Can I propose scope reductions for this project? 

Rachel also talks about the iron triangle often used for project management (time, scope, cost).

For more resources on engineering leadership:
- [This Is Why Most Engineering Managers Are Terrible](https://www.jointaro.com/lesson/4NJbAn0uTDUPfYfa859V/this-is-why-most-engineering-managers-are-terrible/)
- [[Masterclass] What Software Engineers Should Look For In Their Engineering Manager](https://www.jointaro.com/lesson/oeY7ncZhzJ5NO6dij5e7/masterclass-what-software-engineers-should-look-for-in-their-engineering-manager/)
- [[Case Study] Becoming A Tech Lead Again In Just 1 Month After Joining Robinhood From Meta](https://www.jointaro.com/lesson/X8vpfJooDpsX915ouC00/case-study-becoming-a-tech-lead-again-in-just-1-month-after-joining-robinhood-from-meta/)

Negotiation Course: Rahul's History And Success With Negotiation

Rahul's compensation went from $110K at the beginning of his career to $830K in his peak earning year, 2021, as a Tech Lead and Manager at Meta (Facebook). That's more than 7x! A lot of his Total Compensation (TC) growth can be attributed to his ability to negotiate. There were 2 main segments of negotiation in Rahul's career: 

- 2013: 5 offers at Facebook, Google, Twitter, Microsoft, and Square
- 2017: 6 offers at Facebook, Google, Snapchat, Stripe, Uber, and Airbnb

This gave Rahul the leverage he needed to see dramatic increases in compensation. Some examples: 

- The Snapchat stock grant went from $600K --&gt; $1.0MM and the signing bonus went from $10K --&gt; $100K
- The Facebook stock grant went from $325K --&gt; $600K and the signing bonus went from $30K --&gt; $45K

The numbers here are due primarily to timing, information, and options, all things you can learn. The results can be life-changing, and you don't need to be a genius programmer to discover your own version of this.

These data points show how negotiation is extremely high leverage. A few hours of extra work can lead to a change of 6 figures or more in compensation.

- Rahul's YouTube video about 5 offers he received as a new grad: <https://youtu.be/rceUVaiXQgU> 
- Rahul's YouTube video about how compensation in tech works: <https://youtu.be/wqdpzu4Oa2I>

3 Mistakes Too Many Software Engineers Make (from a Director at Airbnb)

As Head of Search Engineering at Airbnb, [Rachel Zhao](https://www.linkedin.com/in/rachelzhao/) has coached + mentored many engineers as they climb the ladder. She calls out 3 things NOT to do for software engineers: 

1. **Don't work too hard (for an extended period)** - This leads to burnout, which hampers both your health and your growth. Rachel regularly spends time reflecting and figure out what new skill/project she can take on. You can learn more about the importance of reflection when it comes to productivity in [our video here](https://link.jointaro.com/dXkvKXs4FfbK5V6h7).
2. **Don't say "I'm not learning enough"** - At the end of the day, the company hired you to do a job - Growth is more of a 2nd order priority for many companies. This means that you need to be proactive about owning your growth - Don't just expect your manager to hand you the perfect curriculum of projects to get to the next level. For in-depth advice on how to create that scope for yourself to get to the next level, check out [this in-depth Q&A advice](https://link.jointaro.com/bah6v7RFpnywVYyv9).
3. **Don't focus on the score, focus on the game** - In particular, don't focus too much on level and viewing others as competitors. Think about how your org functions and how you can add the most impact. Check out our in-depth advice on [how to view levels when it comes to your career](https://link.jointaro.com/JJBA5KSCLdoK9Sc39).

The Journey to Staff Engineer In Big Tech - Q&A

This is the Q&A portion of the Staff Engineer Panel discussion. Watch the [main content here](https://www.jointaro.com/lesson/SaYyJGLYvrAy4XGrDhy7/the-journey-to-staff-engineer-in-big-tech-panel-discussion/).

The journey to Staff Engineer is unique for everybody. In this session, we talk about all the ways we got there! Senior Engineer is a terminal level at most tech companies. 

Staff Engineer is the next level up. This is referred to as Staff at Meta/Google, or Principal Engineer at Amazon/Microsoft. 

Questions answered in the video: 
- I'm making a career change into Software Engineering -- what advice would you have? I want to get into Augmented/Virtual Reality.
- I'm already a Staff Engineer, but I'm struggling with performance management. What advice would you have to exceed expectations?
- What resources would you recommend to improve at communication? What is an effective way to find a mentor?
- I'd like to first become a Tech Lead (TL) and then transition into a Staff Engineer role. What advice would you have for me?
- I'm a Data Engineer (DE) and big fan of Zach! How do I show the impact of my work to a manager who may be unfamiliar, especially since I don't do frontend?

See discussions about Staff Engineers on Taro: [https://www.jointaro.com/topic/staff-engineer/](https://www.jointaro.com/topic/staff-engineer/)

Publicly available promotion stories:
- [Ryan's Instagram video processing improvements](https://engineering.fb.com/2022/11/04/video-engineering/instagram-video-processing-encoding-reduction/)
- [Rahul's internal tool for debugging](https://www.jointaro.com/lesson/qvp2quodqAEWSkN7sayt/case-study-building-a-meta-internal-tool-to-empower-an-entire-org-staff-promotion-story/)

Panelists:
- [Zach Wilson](https://www.linkedin.com/in/eczachly/)
- [Rahul Pandey](https://www.linkedin.com/in/rpandey1234/)
- [Carly Taylor](https://www.linkedin.com/in/carly-taylor-data/)
- [Lee McKeeman](https://www.linkedin.com/in/lmckeeman/)
- [Ryan Peterman](https://www.linkedin.com/in/ryanlpeterman/)

Rachel's Career Story: Waterloo, Yelp, Airbnb

To check out Rachel's excellent tech career advice, you can find the [full playlist here](https://link.jointaro.com/EFUYvmLHzenKQLRp6).

Rachel moved to Canada in high school, and then attended the University of Waterloo where she picked up programming for the first time. 
- She did various internships as part of the co-op program, and her first job out of college was at Yelp. 
- After 9 years at Yelp, Rachel had become a Director of Engineering there.
- Since 2020, Rachel has been an Engineering Lead at Airbnb, heading up the search product there.

**Rachel's core learning**: The times where you're uncomfortable and struggle are the times you learn the most. Stay calm and embrace the more difficult times in your career - When you view these situations as a growth opportunity, that's how you come out of them stronger than you were before.

How To Quickly Understand Company Culture - Airbnb Example

Culture is more than what people say. It's about how things get done in the company. The best way to ramp up on a company's culture is to observe what people do and talk to as many people as possible when you first join.

Rachel also talks about the 2 unique aspects of Airbnb's culture: 
1. Mission-driven (as opposed to tech, sales, or founder driven)
2. Incorporating the best of different companies

If you want to learn more about how to understand an org/company and build up influence within it, here's some related resources:
- ["How do I sell the vision behind a large, org-level project?"](https://link.jointaro.com/ESa5WJyk682iwqJt9)
- ["How can I build up more influence in an org?"](https://link.jointaro.com/GVYFUhx46N2QWVeZ7)

YOE: 10 months remote at an AWS Partner (DevOps/AWS account remediation stuff)\
TC: $136k

Hello, I’m in my early career and in need of some career advice. I would like to get into a SRE-SWE role at Google, preferably in Zurich (I’m a US citizen) for better career growth and new life experience. 

**My background:** I switched into this field a bit late... 30 years old and now 10 months on the job. I decided I really wanted to learn to code after working in product and I made the switch. I took up a Javascript course online, within 7 months studying full time  I had completed a couple portfolio projects including a full stack project. At that point I decided I didn’t like front-end and I got into learning AWS cloud architecture. My coding background + achieving an AWS Associate Architect certification quickly found me a high paying role at an AWS consulting Partner in the devopsy space.

Currently I work remotely at a tiny AWS Partner where Terraform and AWS Cloud remediation is my main work. Though I had no intention of giving up coding, the job I got into pays well but is not exactly what I was expecting...  

\
After the first couple months of trial-by-fire with terraform - my job stopped being challenging and I have tons of free time (which I used to get 4 AWS certs so far.) Terraform hasn’t been difficult once I got the hang of it, and most of it I don’t consider actual brain-exercising coding work like I had done when learning to code (i.e codewars). Lately, I feel my only growth has come from the knowledge I’ve gained from self-studying for my AWS certs.  Though I have enjoyed studying for my AWS certs and gaining depth about cloud services (I really enjoy research and distributed cloud architecture to make things work on a mass scale is amazing)  and I just cleared the AWS Certified DevOps Pro exam which was a significant milestone for me. BUT…

1. My coding skills are getting rusty and I never had proper programming mentoring on a professional team to begin with. I joined this company as a junior and have only really grown in Cloud Architecture (does that count as Systems Design?), AWS/Iaac Terraform, but not as a SWE.  I have never done leetcode, I don’t know DS and Algos. My interview was about a 3 tier app architecture. My company runs Terraform like a code-cowboy environment and my code almost never gets reviewed properly. And as I said, I’m not doing much here these days, which although is great if you I want to earn money and coast (or self-learn picking up the difficult cloud certs) I am definitely underutilized and not in a collaborative “team” environment. Work is siloed by customer with one senior engineer being the guy assigned to handle all the cool stuff for a customer and I receive undesirable work like dealing with logs or fixing pain in the arse security stuff that no one else wants to be bothered with. (I.E and maybe a bad example, but no one wants to be bothered with accidentally taking down production to remediate ssh ports being open to 0.0.0.0/0, so let the jr take the fall or do nothing since the customer doesn't care about it and won't pay for it)
2. Here’s what I’m thinking - I could use my copious free time to get GCP Pro certs, maybe learn Kubernetes and then decide on another programming language to main and grind 6 months of leetcode to prepare to get into a Google SRE-SWE role or maybe Airbnb as a 2nd choice. Is this plan sound? Please advise. I don’t even know if I’ll like/need to learn Kubernetes, but I’m prepared to do what it takes to team match in my current cloud specialization. Do I need to learn Kube administration for Google SRE work?  I’m ready to get back to coding and I can nose to the grindstone leetcode for as long as it takes. The AWS Pro cert was a grueling grind as well, so I know I have the discipline to do it.
3. I’m deciding upon a new programming language to main since I am not enamored with JS at all. I’m thinking either Golang or Python ( I’m already learning Godot and GDscript in my spare time as a hobby) and whichever language I go with will preferably be my main for leet code DS and Algos interviews and my career in tech. What I heard about Golang that I like is that there is typically a correct way to do something rather than a million ways to do one thing. I find that very appealing. Please advise on the language I should go with if you can as well.. My current job has been a good place to excel in self-study while being paid and now is the time to take aim for new goals  and steer the wheel on the ship of my career.

Also I really love working remotely but I would go to the office if it meant Google and a new life experience in Switzerland.

And I would really love any insight you can give about such SRE-SWE roles and if that sounds like the best fit for my current cloud specialization and interests. Thank you

Seeking career advice from Senior SWE’s & SRE’s to get to Google (1st choice) or Airbnb

Mid-Level Software Engineer at Taro Community

I am currently working at Airbnb as a contractor for 1 year through a services-based company, with 6 months already passed. I am looking to increase my chances of transitioning to a full-time employee. I am working on a high-visibility project with a small team of 3-4 engineers and one tech lead, and my work is well-regarded by senior engineers and managers. However, I feel there are areas where I could improve, such as generating new ideas for projects and contributing to the roadmap. The next 6 months of plans have already been created by the tech lead. Historically, others from my company who transitioned to full-time roles took at least a year. How can I increase my chances of converting to a full-time role?

How to Increase Chances of Transitioning from Contractor to Full-Time Employee at Airbnb

Hi all,

I joined Airbnb about 6 months ago and have been told by my manager that I'm doing superbly and that he seems me becoming one of the top people in my org. I don't think he's the type to over-embellish or say things that aren't true so I believe him.

Given that, there's already a lot of strong senior and staff engineers in my team and org. How should I approach finding those juicier opportunities to make larger impacts outside of my immediate projects?

I'm one of the most productive engineers on my team right now but finding those high-leverage and larger impact projects on my own has always been challenging for me. I'm not an ideas person but I'm a solid executor.

Recently, I've been on a really large project that was simply handed to me and one that I'm not leading that's taken up the entire company's time but after this is all over, I'd like to start brainstorming and executing on some of these more unique and high-impact projects that can help me become a Staff engineer. I want to get into a position where I'm driving high-impact projects that ideally I come up with.

Would appreciate some advice on how to approach my current situation and work towards this goal.

Thanks!

Getting to Staff in a competitive environment

Hi, I am currently working at Airbnb as a contractor and have noticed some internal openings in other teams. I reached out to a recruiter about one of the roles, and she has asked about my background. She is aware that I am a contractor. I’m concerned about whether she might inform my manager, as I’m worried this could affect my current position or how my manager perceives me. Could someone advise me on whether it’s safe to share my information with the recruiter ?

Concern About Internal Applications as a Contractor

Exhaust the feedback is a process that we teach people, it is not that the feedback is exhausting. :-)

How to do it better and properly? What worked for you in the past, not just online search or Chat GPT answers, please?

I learnt a lot from this course from the topic, but it was not enough for me: <https://www.jointaro.com/lesson/s2WDysyVB0AeBrrtzzy0/get-the-rating-you-deserve-part-14-regular-check-ins/>

- Reducing stress + mindfulness.
- Relationship with communication

How would you approach, learn and improve on the topics like that?

Reducing stress and reducing emotional responses

Any thoughts on the topics like that? Especially if folks on the team are younger gen 10-15 years younger, and all from silicon valley and staff+ levels.

- Long hours are not enough → relationships mgmt with partners

- Emotional regulation and awareness

  - Mindfulness

  - 5 seconds interventions to turn interactions around

    - How starting determines the outcomes - most of the time

- How to escalate vs. not. + how to respond when somebody escalates

Relationship building + how to respond when somebody escalates

Airbnb is an American company that operates an online marketplace for lodging and tourism activities. Based in San Francisco, California, the platform is accessible via website and mobile app.

[**Alex Chiou**](https://www.linkedin.com/in/alexander-chiou/) is a proven Silicon Valley engineer with 10+ years of experience across top tech companies like PayPal, Course Hero (now Learneo, a $3.6B unicorn), Meta, and Robinhood, where he was a high-performing tech lead making $750,000/year working \~30 hour weeks.

## FAANG Rockstar

Alex spent the biggest chunk of his career at Meta (\~4 years), a company that's notorious for [ruthlessly cutting low-performers](https://www.jointaro.com/question/lScy3l2NPIrWvRuHOjcF/how-does-stack-ranking-work-at-faang-and-how-can-i-be-proactive-at-a-base-level/) and demanding the world from their engineers ([literally forcing them to go from junior -&gt; senior within 5 years](https://www.jointaro.com/question/X3ccTVVCpuS1T76HI5fX/how-does-up-or-out-work-and-whats-the-transition-generally-like-for-e3-greater-e4-greater-e5/)).

Despite this, Alex got an "Exceeds Expectations" rating or higher in every single one of his performance reviews? How did he do it? Simple: *By getting far more done than most other Meta engineers*. During his later years at Meta, Alex got the following done every half (6 months):

- Landed \~270 commits (Top 5% code committer)
- Reviewed \~720 commits (Top 1% code reviewer)
- Got 100+ public thanks
- Mentored \~5 engineers to promotions (more than several engineering managers)

Alex was able to do this despite averaging \~40 hour weeks at Meta, rarely working weekends and late nights.

## Work-Life Balance Champion

Alex has always believed that the healthiness of your personal life and career are deeply interconnected, striving to live that reality by hyper-efficiently spending his time. From Meta to Robinhood and now Taro, Alex has:

- Spent time with his parents every week
- Found time to regularly hang out with his friends
- Done all the cooking for himself and his wife
- Done a bunch of other chores around the house
- Gotten consistent sleep and exercise
- Made time for his hobbies (any other Genshin Impact and Magic: The Gathering players out there?)

It may seem impossible, but you can indeed have it all, even if your goal is to be a high-performing engineer at a top tech company. You simply need to be smart with your time, and Alex is living proof of that.

Alex Chiou

Software engineers aren't paid an insane amount of money out of the goodness of tech corporations' hearts: It's because they need to consistently deliver while under the weight of sky-high expectations.

Now here's the problem: It is extremely easy to be unproductive as an engineer, *even if you're working incredibly hard*. There are so many software engineers out there who are working 80+ hour weeks but barely meeting expectations.

If you're frustrated with how little you're getting from your time, let's fix that and turn you into a rockstar who also has respectable work-life balance. After going through this course, you will:

- 💯 Know the **true** most important productivity booster

- 💡 Champion the right **mentality** to foster productivity

- 🏃‍♂️ Use the right tactics to **move faster**

- 🛡️ Have shields to prevent you from **wasting time**

- 🤔 Learn how to **debug** a lack of productivity

At the end of the day, time is the only resource that matters. With every minute of your day, you have an effectively infinite amount of ways to spend it, most of them inefficient. In a nutshell, this course will empower you to make the right decision with every unit of your time so you can get more done with less of it.

Maximize Your Productivity As A Software Engineer

Overview

Move Faster

Stop Being Lazy

Conclusion

At the end of the day, working in tech, or anywhere really, is all about working with other human beings. Communication is the core skill necessary to make this collaboration effective.

Senior Staff Engineers have influence across multiple teams and orgs. They are critical contributors to the direction of their organization, participating in strategic planning, budgeting, and resource allocation.

Staff engineers are extremely vital to any engineering team, viewing the landscape from the overall team charter level instead of individual projects.

Work-life balance (WLB) is the state of equilibrium where a person equally prioritizes the demands of one's career and the demands of one's personal life. Having too many responsibilities at work is the primary cause of poor WLB.

Reducing stress and reducing emotional responses

Related Course

Other Great Discussions